2000 Mexico RamCharger

[crazzywolfie]

i think the ones on e-bay come with springs but i don't know much about springs. they may or may not be good for what you need.

[rjtx667]

I don't know much, but know they depend on your cam. The cam I has too high of a lift to use stock springs, but you also don't want to go too stiff.

IE stock is like 80-90 ft lbs closed and my cam needs 120

open stock is 200, I need 320-340

but stock lift is .432 and mine is .480/.512

[rjtx667]

Well   

I just don't know anymore 

Talked to the guy today after work, he said he talked to 4 or 5 people about springs, and they all said the springs he bought were good for the cam.

One of the guys would be the SAME guy that last week told me the seat pressure was too high!!! When we had him on the phone today, he started back peddling pretty fast on that comment.    I was not impressed, makes it seem like all he was after was selling me a $400 set of springs, retainers, and lockers.

Well I was looking online this evening and it gets better.

http://www.mopartsracing.com/parts/a/chartvs.gif

the P4876064 would be the spring in question. Notice on the chart how it says it has an installed height of 1.86"?

Anyone want to take a guess at the installed height of my springs? 1.610" !!!!!!

So it may or may not be his fault, but the issue is not the spring, the issue is the spring seat and it not having the correct installed height.

He did say he was told the heads were ported, and he is going to check with where he bought them. If they are not ported he will make it right. So I feel better all in all.

I still want to get the lower end re-done just because its out and it won't cost much (how $500 is not much I am not sure  )

after that I guess we will see where it goes.

[SixGun]

Sorry to hear all that but I do think that you should get a 2nd opinion from a reputable shop that specializes with Mopar.  Might even call some Mopar speed shops in the know for some advice.

James @ Brutal Off-Road (can PM through RCC - BrutalOwner)  He is a wealth of information.  Nice guy too.

http://www.moparproshop.com/

http://www.manciniracing.com/

http://www.bpemopar.com/

[rjtx667]

So confirmed the seat height is wrong and causing issues.

Trying to figure out how I should go about fixing it, talked to machine shop... 

Its like the guy wants to always be right "yeah I know that"

you know that? then why did you not say anything, you said the seat pressure was too high, you did not say it was because the seat height was too low.

So then I ask him, if thats the case why not fix the seat height and use the $400 springs vs your cheap cheby springs? He did not have a good answer, but agreed we could do that.

I also looked at the heads while there, I confirmed at home that the intake has not been ported as the gasket is larger than the intake runners.

The heads are bone stock, still have the casting marks.

So we have to see what the PO will do about that, but its confirmed. I am also working with Indy heads, we had a "issue" back in june 2011 that never got worked out. If we can get it worked out I might be getting a set of RHS/ Indy heads... if not then I will probably do the EQ Monster Magnums.

More than I want to spend, but want it done right and want a good engine. Stock heads are not going to do what I need/ want.

[rjtx667]

So I think I have decided to go get all my parts from the machine shop and take a slower approach to this mess.

I talked with James @ Brutal some and he gave me some contacts to reach out to.

I think I am going to go with some EQ heads once I find the shop I like to build them up for me. I still have lots of un answered questions for the small block and that will take time to work through.

But I want to work though it all, and don't seem to be getting that help at the current machine shop. They want to do a stock short block and be done with it. That could be ok, but maybe not, and why spend the $$ until I am sure what I want.

[SixGun]

I'm really glad you decided to talk with James.  He is like a Mopar encyclopedia and full of good advice. 

If you are not getting the machine shop to understand what you are going for and see your vision then there's a problem.  You definately need to find a different shop.  Especially if you are not getting a warranty from them anyways.  No reason to stick with them.

Just take your time and do the homework so you don't have any regrets.

[rjtx667]

Man I feel lost 

Too many options and formulas and ways to build an engine without any solid advice I have found so far.

Some books say 9.1:1 CR is max, others 9.5:1. Yet there are those online that are doing 10.5:1 or whatever all on pump gas.

So while CR is a factor, you also have quench and deck hight and how your cam plays with the CR. Its going to take me a while (I fear) to figure out exactly what I want and how to do it.

The machine shop tried to do a quick spin of "well just look on their site and know what cc the head is, then it tells you the compression ratio" Well that is the static CR, what about the dynamic CR. And what about quench? and zero deck? and how will my cam play with that CR?

I can't just grab a number out of thin air and hope it will work. Thats what the PO did and is why I am now where I am at.

Guess its a good think I have LASIK today so I won't be able to do anything anyways lol

now I just need to be able to see after LASIK and I will be in good shape.

[SixGun]

I read in Mopar Speed Secrets PN: P4452790 that 9.0 - 9.5:1 is max on premium pump gas and slightly higher CR's can be used if maximum spark advance is decreased.  That being said, I would stay on the safer side and go with 9.0 in case of poor quality gas or carbon buildup that will slightly increase CR as the engine gets aged.  Would hate to damage an expensive engine like this one.

http://chucker54.stores.yahoo.net/mo9thedensps1.html

[rjtx667]

yeah I have seen the 9.5:1 as well, but then I read online and see all these guys running 9.8:1 or 10.5:1.

But that seems to have a lot to do with how big your cam is, if its big enough then some compression "leaks" out either intake/ exhaust/ or both  because of the duration and that helps to avoid pinging.

The other big thing is the quench, which needs to be about .040", anything more can also cause ping. So its real important to get all the numbers just right so that you don't end up with a screwed up engine.

There was an example of going from 10:1 to 9.5:1 where the 9.5:1 was worse because the quench was .080" and would not let the fuel/ air work as the should.

so lots more reading and number crunching to do. Got a feeling the block is coming home and some more measurement tools are going to show up at my house so I can get the numbers to crunch.

[SixGun]

I have never heard of the term "quench" before.  Where did you find this term.  Got me curious. 

Check out this Hughes cam and watch the video.
http://www.hughesengines.com/Index/products.php?browse=category&level0=QmlnIEJsb2NrIDM4My0zNjEtNDAwIChMb3cgRGVjayk=&level1=Q2Ftc2hhZnQ=&level2=V2hpcGxhc2ggTXVzY2xlIENhciBDYW1z&partid=25115

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=akNAKzkSNcg&feature=player_embedded

[rjtx667]

Well I am feeling a bit better now.

Found Mike at MRL Performance. Only does Mopars and is a great and friendly guy.

http://www.mrlperformance.com/index.html


He listend to what I have and what I want (he used to work at Chrysler and even knew what a 2000 Ramcharger was  )

He gave me a lot of pointers real fast and a basic plan.

Keep the 9.1:1 CR unless the pistons are bad or a bore is required. No need to get a higher CR for power

The cam is a mild but good cam and should keep it

Get new heads with a little port work

Sell the M1 intake and get a AirGap intake.

Once done and cleaned up, it will have lots of low end torque and run great.


as for quench, its something I found in my mopar build book and online.

http://www.theoldone.com/archive/quench-area.htm

Quench, or squish area is typically the flat area on the top of the piston that's almost level with the top of the block deck. It must have a corresponding flat area on the deck surface of the head to qualify as quench.
If you look at a combustion chamber, you will usually see these flat areas, and they will have the volume of the actual combustion chamber between them. When the piston is compressing the mixture, as the piston nears the head, the flat areas on the head and piston come together and force the mixture from those areas to "squish" into the chamber, where the spark plug and burning mixture reside, so you achieve a more complete burn.
The quench area also runs cooler than the rest of the chamber / piston. These lower temperatures are where the "quench" comes from.
When properly designed, the quench areas can have a tremendous effect on the quality of combustion, and allow higher compression ratios, and due to this they are considered "artificial octane" by scientific types.
Bottom line is "properly designed, quench is good".

[SixGun]

Cool .... are you buying the heads from them?

[rjtx667]

Not sure where the heads are coming from yet, I just know what they are...

EQ Monster Magnum with 2.02 Stainless Steel Valves and my springs I already have.

Get a good 3-6 angle valve job and some minor porting on the bowel and it will flow more than the engine can make.

The intake I am going to try and clean up a little myself and get a "turtle" for it to help with the low end torque the M1 intake normally looses.

[rjtx667]

Well I decided it is going to be a bit before the new carpet can be ordered and installed, and I am tired of the loudness

So I finished the sound matt under the driver seat, and laid the carpet back down. I also got the rest of the front seats installed again so that more than just me can ride in it. 

Hopefully tomorrow I can get the rear row installed and seat belts back in. Get some car seats back there and let the kids cruise lol.


So the bad news

Machine shop called

1) block is factory... factory bearings, factory pistons, never been touched
2) block appears good, will vat and mag tomorrow to verify
3) crank is toast. One of the bearings was shot 

I am really not happy hearing 1 and 3.... looks like I will be going to pay a visit with the PO again on monday, I want to get the pistons and what not to take with me and show him


sounded like a new crank should not be too expensive.... if I had more $$ I would say go with a 4.0 crank lol  but I am broke as it is... does not help francisco found more parts in MX so I have to try and get those now.