2005 Dodge Ram 2500 Cummins 2wd

[ProjectM880]

just the converter for now.

There is enough clearance to start it with it pushed back.. just barely.

The magnum's have the starter teeth on the convertor so that does not work so well.

I'm curious about how this will go. I've never seen it done this way.

Good Luck 

[rjtx667]

well it did not go as I wished....

Got the converter loose and pushed back, still could not see much. the flex plate seemed solid and not moving.

I connected the starter back up and started it. The converter was free wheeling from the wind of the flex plate.

The sound was still there.

Could be the flex plate still, or could be something in the engine.Its just strange to me it does not make a sound until 1200 RPM?

I am going to get a oil sample off and see what they find with that. I also want to check and see if the crank has any play in it from the flex pate... someone suggested that online as well.

I am really starting to worry I might have to pull the engine. I don't want to do that... rebuild kit is 1500 + machine shop cost.

I think my engine hoist could pull it out (2ton), but I would need a HD engine stand and who knows what else.

[ProjectPW]

well it did not go as I wished....

Got the converter loose and pushed back, still could not see much. the flex plate seemed solid and not moving.

I connected the starter back up and started it. The converter was free wheeling from the wind of the flex plate.

The sound was still there.

Could be the flex plate still, or could be something in the engine.Its just strange to me it does not make a sound until 1200 RPM?

I am going to get a oil sample off and see what they find with that. I also want to check and see if the crank has any play in it from the flex pate... someone suggested that online as well.

I am really starting to worry I might have to pull the engine. I don't want to do that... rebuild kit is 1500 + machine shop cost.

I think my engine hoist could pull it out (2ton), but I would need a HD engine stand and who knows what else.

Indeed it is no easy task to swap a cummins out. I would lean towards a wrist pin or rod bearing failure judging by the conditions you describe. I would recommend a pre-built long block if it comes to that... the time and hassle of rebuilding an engine from scratch can be a pretty long process. A long block would allow you to pull it and swap over all the new crap and old crap that is necessary and then drop it back in much more efficiently than a total rebuild... but before all that you may need to decide if you will even be able to pull it out. I would recommend an a-frame with a hoist for that. I am thinking of building one for my shop to deal with the heavy/big shit that just doesn't seem to be safe with a conventional engine hoist... that and my tractor will only lift 900-1000 pounds which just isn't enough for a cummins 

There is another option..... pull the head and the oil pan and if it is a wristpin making noise simply swap in a new piston and rod assembly for the one cylinder...it can be done..... if it is a rod bearing it may be salvageable without machining...maybe... you would have to inspect the rod journal for wear/measure/polish... same applies replace piston and rod assembly and install new bearing


I would put money on a wristpin/piston to be the source of your noise....It can be repaired without pulling the motor....just some gambling involved 

[rjtx667]

Yeah the next step is sending off the oil sample. That should give me a good indication of what to do next.

From looking around, a long block is about 3700 where the rebuild kit is 1500 + whatever a machine shop would charge. My guess is $800 or so depending on what needs to be done.

Just have to see, I might pull the head and pan soon to look it over. I know cylinder 6 is weaker than the rest, so thats the most likely problem.

I had hoped for an easy fix, and its not been that yet. I still think it can end up an ok deal... just not the great deal I wanted.

[ProjectM880]

Yeah the next step is sending off the oil sample. That should give me a good indication of what to do next.

From looking around, a long block is about 3700 where the rebuild kit is 1500 + whatever a machine shop would charge. My guess is $800 or so depending on what needs to be done.

Just have to see, I might pull the head and pan soon to look it over. I know cylinder 6 is weaker than the rest, so thats the most likely problem.

I had hoped for an easy fix, and its not been that yet. I still think it can end up an ok deal... just not the great deal I wanted.

Personally I would pull the Oil Pan First to check all the piston rods, bearings, and Crank. Plus you can learn a lot about a engine by looking at the bottom of a oil pan.

[ProjectPW]

Personally I would pull the Oil Pan First to check all the piston rods, bearings, and Crank. Plus you can learn a lot about a engine by looking at the bottom of a oil pan.

yep.... you might find part of a piston skirt... or just a bunch of metalic aluminum sludge... not much to see with the head off.... you wont save that much (if any) over a long block by the time you are done trust me... best to get it pulled and undressed and haul it to wherever as a core. you will be happy when it saves you the hassle of having it torn down waiting on an engine for a month (or more).

[rjtx667]

Well tonight I will get the oil sample ready.

It will take some work to pull the pan, you have to loosen the engine mounts and lift the engine 2-3" out of the truck. Or so they say.

Should be interesting next week.

Noah, do you have a recommendation as to where to get a long block if I do have to go that route? There are some places locally that would save the shipping cost, but I don't know their rep.

[ProjectPW]

Well tonight I will get the oil sample ready.

It will take some work to pull the pan, you have to loosen the engine mounts and lift the engine 2-3" out of the truck. Or so they say.

Should be interesting next week.

Noah, do you have a recommendation as to where to get a long block if I do have to go that route? There are some places locally that would save the shipping cost, but I don't know their rep.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2004-2007-5-9L-Cummins-Diesel-Engine-/221477201276?fits=Make%3ADodge

looks good to me... in dallas.... might call them direct and see if it is cheaper without shipping since you are so close

[ProjectM880]

Any Progress?

[rjtx667]

have the kids this weekend, and had to help my folks move some stuff.

I did get some time today, bought a 24 quart oil drain pan to be able to drain it and get the oil sample.

So I got the torque converter bolted back up and started it up. Let it idle a while to get up to temp and then drained the oil.

While running I had my neighbor rev it to 1200 or so, It seemed I could see the flex plate moving bit, like its warped but not broke?

I could not get the crank to move any, but could see the flex plate flex  a little.

So below are the pics of the oil.

[rjtx667]

So the oil sample goes off tomorrow, but yeah I see metal flakes... question is metal from what?

At this point its starting to look expensive though 

[ProjectM880]

What is that in the center of the pan in the last picture?

[rjtx667]

foil cover from changing the oil in the 03 durango before I tackled this one.

[ProjectM880]

From what I see in the picture I don't see any thing "Major", But pulling the pan will really give you a better idea on whats going on if its a internal engine problem.

If there a way to pull the Torque Converter and Flex plate, then start the motor it would eliminate those as potential problems, but you need something for the starter to engage on. I am un familiar what the new torque converters and flex plates look like. Im use to looking at TF 727 from the 70's and 80's.

I wish you had a Fly Wheel you could bolt up there so you could take off the Torque Converter and Flex Plate  and start the truck.

[rjtx667]

yeah plan to try and drop the pan this weekend. shall see how big of a pita that is. Sounds like its  huge, but shall see.

To drop the converter you have to drop the tranny. I might have to do that yet, as I am 99% sure there is an issue with the flex plate, but have to figure out the engine first.

The starter teeth are on the flex plate, so have to have it on to start it up.

I don't think most suggest it, but the manual says you can replace rods/ pistions/ bearing while the block is in the truck. Just have to pull her open and see how bad it looks.

what is strange to me, not that I know much, is how it can be an engine/ bearing/ whatever issue, yet it idles fine and sounds like nothing is wrong until you rev it up.